Tag: Dark Avengers

CinemaCon: Marvel Studios Title Change for 2025 Film Sparks Online Speculation

Marvel Studios One Above All, Kevin Feige, took the stage at CinemaCon in Las Vegas for the first time and the head honcho did not disappoint. In addition to rolling out the first looks at footage from Deadpool and Wolverine and Captain America: Brave New World, Feige also confirmed a minor title change to one of their 2025 projects and left fans with a cryptic tease about its meaning.

During a recently staged behind-the-scenes video from Marvel Studios’ star Florence Pugh, a new logo and title for the studio’s Thunderbolts project was revealed. Originally titled Thunderbolts, the film’s new logo revealed it was now titled Thunderbolts*. About as minor of a change as one can imagine. During his time on stage in Las Vegas, Feige confirmed the title change while showing off the new logo and also leaving fans hanging as to the meaning of the asterisk. “Yes, you’ll notice the asterisk on Thunderbolts. That is the official title of Thunderbolts and we won’t talk more about that until after the movie comes out.” teased Feige, leaving fans to do what they do best: speculate wildly.

Florence Pugh is here to show you a few things she can't show you.

Marvel Studios’ Thunderbolts* is now in production. pic.twitter.com/XGkNWFm5zC
— Marvel Studios (@MarvelStudios) March 27, 2024

Typically when placed at the end of a word, an asterisk indicates some sort of footnote is being cross-referenced. That does not seem to be the case here which leaves a little mystery around the minor change to the title. It’s possible the asterisk indicates some additional context is needed to understand the title of the film which is also the title of the team of antiheroes who undertake a secret mission in the film. Given all the online hubbub about one purported explanation for how the team gets the name, it’s possible that the asterisk is indeed a reference to how the team chooses its moniker. However, fans are looking much deeper for explanations.

Calling it now, this will become “Dark Avengers” https://t.co/7O0AuspbKF
— James Viscardi (@JimViscardi) April 11, 2024

One possible explanation that’s beginning to take root is that the asterisk somehow indicates that the team will become known as the Dark Avengers, a team that debuted in Marvel Comics in 2009. Ironically enough, word reached my ears almost 6 years ago that Marvel Studios commissioned a writer to put a Dark Avengers script together. At the time, the studio was also still developing Eternals, Black Widow and sequels to hits like Black Panther, Doctor Strange, Spider-Man: Homecoming and Guardians of the Galaxy that were all intended to be set after Avengers: Endgame, which still hadn’t even hit theaters at the time. Time went on, COVID happened and we assumed that like many other projects that begin development–such as Power Pack–, Dark Avengers was moved to the bottom of the pile, never to be heard from again.

Could the asterisk point to a Dark Avengers adaptation? Possibly, though the composition of the current roster of Thunderbolts (Yelena Belova, Taskmaster, Ghost and John Walker) is a long way from the collection of scum and villainy that Norman Osborn put together for the Dark Avengers. Even thematically, the name change doesn’t truly fit since the Dark Avengers were almost all non-redeemable sociopaths and psychopaths. However, as we say far too often, Marvel Studios has no qualms about co-opting names and titles without any intention of comic-accurate adaptations, as proven by the fact that their roster of Thunderbolts features not a single character from the original team despite Daniel Bruhl’s Zemo, founder of the OG team in the comics, being fully established in the MCU. Thunderbolts* is cool but Dark Avengers has the A-word in it and the A-word sells.

Thunderbolts* is currently slated to hit theaters on May 2, 2025.

About Dark Avengers

The Dark Avengers, a formidable and morally ambiguous team within Marvel Comics, emerged as a stark departure from the traditional hero archetype. Introduced during the “Dark Reign” storyline, orchestrated by writer Brian Michael Bendis and artist Mike Deodato, the Dark Avengers debuted in “Dark Avengers” #1 in 2009.

Led by Norman Osborn, the former Green Goblin and head of the clandestine organization H.A.M.M.E.R. (replacing S.H.I.E.L.D. during the “Dark Reign”), the Dark Avengers were a twisted reflection of the original Avengers. Osborn meticulously handpicked each member, often selecting individuals with dark pasts and a willingness to embrace villainy or anti-heroism.

One of the most notable aspects of the Dark Avengers was their masquerade as Earth’s mightiest heroes. Osborn, now rebranded as the Iron Patriot, donned a modified version of Iron Man’s armor and positioned himself as the leader of this new Avengers team. The team roster comprised individuals who assumed the identities of classic Avengers characters, albeit with their own unique twist. For instance, Bullseye took on the mantle of Hawkeye, Moonstone portrayed Ms. Marvel, Venom (Mac Gargan) became Spider-Man, and Daken, the son of Wolverine, assumed the guise of his father.

The dynamic within the Dark Avengers was fraught with tension and moral ambiguity. While some members harbored genuine desires to reform or redeem themselves, others reveled in their newfound power and embraced their darker impulses. This internal conflict often led to explosive confrontations and power struggles within the team.

Despite their dubious motives and methods, the Dark Avengers proved to be a formidable force, wielding significant influence over the Marvel Universe during the “Dark Reign” era. Their actions challenged the very fabric of heroism, blurring the lines between good and evil and forcing readers to question the nature of heroism itself.

Over time, as Osborn’s machinations unraveled and his grip on power weakened, the Dark Avengers disbanded, with each member returning to their own path, whether it be redemption, continued villainy, or anti-heroism. However, their legacy continues to linger in the annals of Marvel Comics, serving as a testament to the complexity of the human condition and the ever-shifting nature of morality in a world of super-powered beings.

April 11, 2024
Murphy’s Team-Up Volume 3: Russos Assemble

In this week’s Murphy’s Team-Up, the group talks about what project they would like to see the Russo brothers tackle when they return to Marvel Studios.

Anthony Canton III

As far as an Avengers team for the Russos to direct, let’s get Captain Marvel, Captain America, Spider-Man, Thor, Dr. Strange, Monica Rambeau, and Banner as our main team. There’ll be support from others if needed but I like that crew. The villain for a crew like this would be Annihilus. A fun scenario would be an earth takeover as the Avengers take on him and his army.

Charles Murphy

While it’s more likely they’re coming back for something major like Secret Wars, I’d be happy for them to work on a Silver Surfer trilogy. Following the mold they cut on their work with Captain America, I’d love to see them explore the “fallen hero” themes from Stan Lee’s seminal late-60s/early 70s run (honestly some of Stan’s finest writing) without having him confined to Earth. Surfer is probably one of the heaviest hitters in the toy box that Marvel Studios bought from Fox and I hear he may be introduced sometime in 2022 (it’s just a rumor for now, so settle down); the Russos, who have expressed their love for the character in the past, could elevate the character to heights he deserves.

John Sabato

The next team I’d like to see the Russos direct is Captain America, Wasp,
Ant-Man, Mighty Thor, Shang Chi, Black Knight, Sersi, and Photon. The villain? AC is right: Annihilus.

Joao Pinto

The Russos have themselves said that the inspiration behind Avengers: Infinity War’s team comprised of Cap, Falcon, Black Widow, and Wanda was Marvel’s Secret Avengers. Even in their debut feature for the franchise, Captain America: The Winter Soldier they managed to get Steve Rogers donning a suit clearly hinting at the one he wore while leading the Secret Avengers in the comics. So with that said, why not give them the keys to their own black-ops superhero team? There are a number of members that have already left the MCU but, hopefully, we’ll soon have brand new characters introduced that would manage to make the cut. Original team members Moon Knight and Nova would be welcomed additions, with Yelena Belova taking Natasha’s place in the team, all while having War Machine serve as the liaison between the team and government authorities. Hank McCoy and Shang-Chi would complete the team, making it extremely diverse in its disfunctionality.

Joseph Aberl

With the Russos potentially returning, it seems like the obvious choice for them to spearhead the project featuring the Avengers fighting Kang the Conqueror, but I’d like to propose a different kind of story. After the aftermath of Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness, the multiverse breaking loose is just a matter of time. They end up realizing that another multiverse is going to try and merge with theirs. A new team featuring Spider-Man, Doctor Strange, the new Black Panther, White Vision, and more face off against an Incursion. They meet familiar and new faces of old friends that force their hand in an unlikely war. Yet, at the end of the day, they realize this was just the prelude. Something sinister is waiting for them in the future.

Mary Maerz

I honestly don’t know who my preferred team for a Russo’s feature would be, but I am most excited for Sam Wilson to make his Avengers debut as Captain America, and would love for the Russos to have a hand in that. With all of the more complex storylines going on in Phase Four, he will definitely ground everything. His character also just rocks and will probably make a lot of wild stuff feel more human and relatable. As far as a villain, I would really like Kang to still be the Big Bad by Avengers 5. After he (his variant) appeared in the Loki series, it seems obvious to me that there is so much potential in building him up over time into something really special. The MCU sort of did that with Thanos, but mostly just through teases—we didn’t really see him do anything in particular until Infinity War. Kang, though, with Ant-Man 3 in particular, has the ability to feel like a huge and constant threat for the foreseeable future if they keep him around. It would definitely have an incredible payoff. Plus Jonathan Majors is going to be amazing, so we’d have a villain with some personality too.

Nathan Miller

I’d honestly rather give Chloe Zhao or Nia DaCosta a go at directing the next Avengers film rather than the Russo brothers. I’d like to see the Russos have a go at a Dark Avengers or Thunderbolts Disney+ series instead. So inline with that, the team would be: Zemo, US Agent, Yelena Belova, Abomination, Songbird, Agatha Harkness and Contessa Valentina Allegra de la Fontaine. I can see them having a rivalry with a team Sam might put together, but not a wholly antagonistic relationship with them, with the bigger fractures likely from within the team itself. As for who they would be taking on, perhaps a villain like Morgan le Fay, or perhaps they might try to lay Siege to New Asgard.

Join us next week for another Murphy’s Team-Up!!

October 18, 2021
Theorizing MARVEL STUDIOS’ Interconnected Storylines

It’s been a little over three months since Marvel Studios properly kicked off its Phase 4. Both WandaVision and The Falcon and the Winter Soldier are now behind us, two shows that gave us but a glimpse of what is in store in the coming years in terms of the interconnectivity between the different IPs that make up the MCU. This is something Kevin Feige himself made extremely clear this past December, during the Disney Investor Day 2020:

The Cinematic Universe weaves storylines of heroes and villains across twenty-three feature films to date, and with Disney+ we’re able to extend this way of storytelling to a new format, creating series that are connected to our theatrical releases making the MCU more immersive than ever.

As for WandaVision, it managed to bring together characters from properties that seemed somewhat foreign to its titular characters (bringing them in from Thor, Captain Marvel, and Ant-Man). The Falcon and The Winter Soldier did almost the exact opposite. It grabbed most of its main characters from the same feature (Captain America: Civil War) and continued their arcs in a way that seems to hint at them diverging into several other (new) IPs. The common ground between both approaches seems quite simple: when the story asks for it, characters will come and go from whatever property that needs them to. With this in mind, and with the number of projects Marvel Studios has already announced, it’s hard to not try and envision some of the paths the stories these characters might take us on.

The existing connective tissue between properties is stronger with some than with others, even though Marvel Studios will always end up surprising us one way or another. But most of the more realistic theorizing (if there even is such a thing), taking into account the information that has already come out regarding casts, plots, and so on, seems to hint at a clear/not clear separation between what are the military-powered, skill-driven heroes and the more mystic and cosmic side of the MCU. So being, we’ll now focus on the first of these two groups.

The Falcon and the Winter Soldier seems to be at the heart of the stories we might end up exploring on this side of the spectrum. With Karli Morgenthau being one of the few main characters to have (apparently) died, all the others are now ready to move on, each doing their own thing. With Sam Wilson as Captain America, he seems like a given to star in the upcoming fourth installment of the Captain America series. As for Bucky Barnes, with a Nomad series apparently in development, Barnes seems like a perfect fit. As for James “War Machine” Rhodes, he might now become the direct link to Iron Man’s legacy Riri Williams comes into contact with in Ironheart, before both move into Armor Wars, where they could be met by Sharon Carter in her newfound MCU role. Black Widow will introduce us to Yelena Belova who can seamlessly move on to Hawkeye (even if just to attend a memorial service), where Echo will be show up before staring in her own show.

Shifting our attention to the other side of the diagram, we find several connections between shows that have already been confirmed. Monica Rambeau will be back in the franchise where she was first introduced, where she will be met by Kamala Khan who will have already been introduced in the Ms. Marvel series. Both might be met in The Marvels by Talos, who will also have a role to play in the upcoming Secret Invasion alongside Nick Fury. As to Wanda Maximoff, now the Scarlet Witch, she is certain to continue her story in Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness which may become the epicenter of every upcoming property dealing with the Multiverse. Loki and Spider-Man: Far From Home seem like projects that are likely to have strong connections to the second Doctor Strange feature for obvious plot reasons, at the same time as they connect through other storylines to yet another set of properties. With the information coming out of Loki that Gugu Mbatha-Raw will be playing Judge Renslayer (meaning that almost certainly that makes her Ravonna Renslayer) it becomes highly likely that Kang will make an appearance, ahead of his already highlighted presence in Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania, played by the brilliant Jonathan Majors.

These stories alone are certain to keep Marvel gaining momentum for years to come, but what seems to be the endgame here? Establishing new properties where characters from all over manage to meet for the first time, bringing together story threads from all sides of the MCU, certainly seems like a possibility. Projects that haven’t been announced as that might somewhat spoil the plots leading up to them. It should be no coincidence that a number of upcoming projects will seamlessly allow for the introduction of Young Avengers members, much like WandaVision and The Falcon and the Winter Soldier managed to do with Tommy and Billy Maximoff, and Eli Bradley, respectively. Kate Bishop is already confirmed to be debuting in Hawkeye, and the rest of the team will probably soon follow, with Teddy perhaps being introduced in Secret Invasion, America Chavez in Doctor Strange 2, and Cassie Lang returning, as Stature, in Quantumania. Therefore, a Young Avengers series/movie should definitively be in the works bringing together their individual storylines. Another team being put together, even though a much different one, should be the focus of the Thunderbolts. With Baron Zemo and Abomination brought back, Taskmaster (the mantle) surviving Black Widow, and with Ghost still alive after Ant-Man and the Wasp, there is no reason for it not to be in the cards. Another feature that could serve as a continuation to John Walker’s story, maybe even bringing Yelena into the mix, and perhaps managing to dig up an Osborn to lead them, is The Dark Avengers. Marvel Studios knows that they can’t top the Avengers team they built up until Avengers: Endgame, so this focus on alternate teams, some of dubious character, would certainly be welcomed as a great change of pace.

There are a few projects that have already been announced that played no part in this theory. For all I know they might end up becoming the most crucial chapters of the MCU going forward. The Fantastic Four, due to their relevance, or the Eternals, due to their scope, certainly have that ability. But for now, this is it. Maybe in a couple of months, the script will be flipped and a new article will be in the works.

May 4, 2021
EXCLUSIVE: MARVEL STUDIOS HAS COMMISSIONED A ‘DARK AVENGERS’ SCRIPT

Note: This article was originally published by Charles Murphy at That Hashtag Show on October 5, 2018

Marvel Studios has enjoyed an unprecedented 10 year run of box office success as that began with 2008’s Iron Man. That film gave the studio the momentum it needed to build a cinematic universe around a few well-known heroes, take some gambles on a few others and tell a longform story unlike any that’s come before. That story, however, will come to an end with 2019’s Avengers 4 as will the tenures of several of the studio’s flagship heroes leaving fans to wonder what comes next. Some of the heroes and franchises will live on post-Infinity with sequels being developed for Guardians of the Galaxy, Spider-Man, Doctor Strange and Black Panther; other new heroes such as Captain Marvel and Monica Rambeau will be introduced before Avengers 4 and become a part of the story that comes next; new franchises, such at The Eternals, are being developed, showing that Kevin Feige and company are still willing to roll the dice on some lesser known characters even as their deal to bring home the X-Men, Fantastic Four and related characters creeps towards closure.

As exciting as the influx of new characters is for fans, Feige couldn’t have counted on them to shoulder the load going forward until the recent approvals to the deal. As a result, Marvel Studios has been developing dozens of properties for potential films and those dozens of properties probably stand at a dozen different stages of development. Some of those properties will feature prominently in the future of the MCU and others will never be known to anyone not lucky enough to be a part of the Marvel Studios brain trust. We’ve been fortunate enough to find out about similar projects in the past and today we’re happy to share another: Marvel Studios has developed and completed a script for an adaptation of Dark Avengers.

To be clear, Marvel Studios has many scripts for many projects, not all of which will make it to the big screen. It’s a smart move for the studio to commission as many scripts as possible knowing that at any time someone might come up with a take on an IP that blows people away while also knowing some of them will go straight to the bottom of the pile. We at That Hashtag Show don’t pretend to know where in that pile the Dark Avengers sits, only that a script for the IP was completed .

The Dark Avengers were created by Brian Michael Bendis and first appeared in their own title in January of 2009 in the aftermath of the Skrull Secret Invasion. With the people and the government having lost faith in the Avengers, Norman Osborn, who had been in charge of the Thunderbolts, was appointed head of the reformed S.H.I.E.L.D., now known as H.A.M.M.E.R.. Osborn took the opportunity to assemble his own team of “heroes”, including Sentry, Noh-Varr and Ares and to disguise some Thunderbolts as former Avengers. Osborn’s team included a Mac Gargan “Spider-Man”, a Moonstone “Captain Marvel”, a Bullseye “Hawkeye”, a Daken “Wolverine” and Norman in the Iron Patriot armor. The initial run of the comic lasted 16 issues and ran throughout the Dark Regin and Seige line-wide arcs.

October 5, 2018